Blah Blah Cafe, the Jean-Michel Jarre forum

Hmmmmmmming. My EKO samples sound very different.

PHASEREFFECT

radek tymecki wrote:
GeeJee wrote:Most of Oxygene and Equinoxe rhythm sounds are from minipops. Eko rhythm sounds like random bursts of white and pink noise...
well you're wrong... as far as i can remember minipops was used only in equinoxe 5 [only the special sounds - guiro and quijada]. i can't hear any rhytm combinations from minipops on equinoxe

eq 5 rhytm [played on my minipos]

for example check this - my equinoxe 4 rhytm reproduction... no minipops here

eq 4 rhytm

btw you can see EKO in equinoxe 5 clip

If i remeber correctly:What about using Rock 3 on the Mp7? It´s 1:1 the Equinoxe5 drum pattern (which machine should else have made the beat? What would be the sense to use another drummer besides the Mp7, which sounds exactly the same?) As for Equinoxe4: I´m quite sure it´s a CR-78; i have one and it sounds absolute like that. The CR-78 is programmable and the snare can be triggered in running mode by a external trigger; the open/lclose hihat can be cancelled by pressing the "Cancel voice/cymbal hihat" button.. As for Oxygene: I´m sure it is -all- Mp7, except those tracks in which "noise" drums or only kickdrums were used. Oxy5 with the strange noise beat for example, even the pattern itself would be too long for a drummer (so i don´t think it is a Eko); i think it´s been done like i´ve done a long time ago with two pitch/cutoff LFO´s. Oxygene 3 is not a drum, it is a kick which can be produced from every synthesizer providing a Filter and a Volume-ADSR. I think the main role of the EKO was a switching central for triggering the Mpops/Synths/providing a clock basis and -not- Sequencing. According to the Eko-Info it would be technically seen impossible, it cannot generate any V/oct / V/Hz voltage, even a fat modification with a RAM/DAC/ADC was in that time impossible, cause DAC/ADC´s were way to expensive in that time and not everyone was able to buy those components and -if- it was really a Sequencer: Where are the sequencer knobs (16*6)? No internal RAM=>much knobs. Nono, even not a FL-Studio-like Sequencer type would work there.

Greetings

radek tymecki

PHASEREFFECT wrote:If i remeber correctly:What about using Rock 3 on the Mp7? It´s 1:1 the Equinoxe5 drum pattern

like I said before - guiro ang quijada were used, i'm not sure about kick and snare sound, they don't sound like minipops... i'll check them whan i'll be back at home

for cr78 - i know it was used on equinoxe 4 extended version, i'm not sure with other rhytms...

but remember that there was also geiss rhytmi computer used

radek tymecki wrote:but remember that there was also geiss rhytmi computer used

Which is modded MP7...

radek tymecki

the main equinoxe 5 rhytm comes from minipops [rock 1 rhytm], but the hihats are not mp7's.

still i think that the main eq4 rhytm is not from minipops

I think there was some Eq4 rhythm demo done with a minipops on the old forum...

radek tymecki

Well still I think that there was some cr78 sounds + PROGRAMMABLE geiss rhytmi comp [new sounds + sync function] used for equinoxe

PHASEREFFECT

GeeJee wrote:I think there was some Eq4 rhythm demo done with a minipops on the old forum...

Hi,

I´m absolutely sure sure: No: That is no Minipops. Believe me: It was -only- a CR-78. The Minipops sounds 100% different. About the Geiss-Machine: It is not proven that it was really a modified Mpops. ´til today it is only a assumption.

Greetings

Stef

VinceBlood

Problem is that CR-78 were released from 1979 and Equinoxe were released in 1978 (Equinoxe 4 probably composed and mixed several months before album release).

CR-78 was used for sure in Equinoxe 4 extended, info from Jarre to a guy who explains that on a forum.

If Jarre used a CR-78 in Equinoxe then it was a prototype.

PHASEREFFECT

VinceBlood wrote:Problem is that CR-78 were released from 1979 and Equinoxe were released in 1978 (Equinoxe 4 probably composed and mixed several months before album release).

CR-78 was used for sure in Equinoxe 4 extended, info from Jarre to a guy who explains that on a forum.

If Jarre used a CR-78 in Equinoxe then it was a prototype.

Some other Websites say that the CR-78 was released in 1978

http://www.answers.com/topic/roland-cr-78 for example. I think noone except Roland itself can tell the exact date when it was released.

Stef

PHASEREFFECT

radek tymecki wrote:but the hihats are not mp7's.

I know why you won´t believe that it is not from the Mp7 because the Hihat-panning/volume varies. Why not? Apply a Phaser+Delay (or Stereo Phaser) on the hihats and you´ll get the in the volume/panning varying hihats (unfortunaly i came from a birthday party and i´m way too much drunken to do an example, but if i´m again soberly, i´ll do it, i´ve done it already a while ago). It isn´t a must that a phaser effect (

applies to the entiere frequency range; as you proably know, do hihats working in a high frequency range and if a phaser is applied to this range, it will only affect the hihats and not the BD/SD/QUI. So BD/SD will remain into center, while the HH chnage the stereo field position.

Stef

radek tymecki

theyre not, they sound higher and its range and sound is diffrent. btw in minipops there are two hihats [maracas and hmm cymbal 1[from samples]] and they're really diffrent than those used in equinoxe 4 and 5 etc...

btw hats from minipops has almost same frequencies than other "hatty" sounds [like tsshhh snares]... why we can't we hear phased snares? btw you can't turn some drums off [only the special 3 sounds] to separate for example hihats from snares [even if using balance slider]... not convincing for me... it wasn't minipops

PHASEREFFECT

radek tymecki wrote:theyre not, they sound higher and its range and sound is diffrent. btw in minipops there are two hihats [maracas and hmm cymbal 1[from samples]] and they're really diffrent than those used in equinoxe 4 and 5 etc...

btw hats from minipops has almost same frequencies than other "hatty" sounds [like tsshhh snares]... why we can't we hear phased snares?

Maybe because the phaser-position was controlled by a tempo-synced LFO? What, if the snare appears, when the "phaser-position" is on the middle at this moment?

btw you can't turn some drums off [only the special 3 sounds] to separate for example hihats from snares [even if using balance slider]... not convincing for me... it wasn't minipops[/quote]

But there -is no sound- which was cancelled! We´re talking about equinoxe 5 and not 4! At the -end- of EQ5 is the snare & HH cancelled, correct, but have you ever turned after EQ5 your loudspeakers to 100%? In the backround you can hear the snare, because it is the -task- of the balance slider to cancel those instruments (mostly all "noise"-instruments like snare and hihat, as long noone has tweaked the balance- potentimeter inside the Mp7).

I´ll do a short example, wait a moment.

Stef

PHASEREFFECT

Ok, apology, i don´t get it at the moment, i have removed the clock sync of my Mp7 since a long time, i have to re-activate it first. Necessary is:

- clock synced Mp7
- synced phaser, 180 degrees at -exactly- half clock-speed of the Mp7, applied to freuencies over 9000 Hz
- Equalizer (31/63Hz down, lift 125/250 Hz ) to move the BD into a "real" kickdrum, lower 8 KHz and lift between 8 and 16 Khz).

The trick is to catch the snare at the absolute middle position of the phaser, so the HH gets L/R phased while the SD/GUI/QUI stays in the middle, but that won´t work as long both MP7 and the Phaser are not sync´d (also possible that JMJ used the single signals of each instument, HH for phaser, remaining for EQ). GUI and QUI are even working in a freq-Range below 9 KHz, so the phaser won´t affect them.

Aplogoy #2: My Mp7 is modified regarding "balance", i´ve applied the balance-slider to the noise-level of the noise-generator, located on the upper board (i´ve forgot that, i´ve done somewhere around 4/5 Years ago,proove: http://www.phasereffect.com/pub/test21.mp3, humming removed, crackling=silders).

Greetings

Stef

Mogwai

The drums on Equinoxe 4 is the EKO Computerhythm. There are some great additional CR-78 sounds on the extended remix but not on the original.
Equinoxe 4 is the only track that I've heard were Jarre actually use his EKO like it was intended, as a drummachine. Mainly he used it together with sequencers as a start/stop device.

If one wants to hear it in action for real then you have to dig up records with Manuel Göttsching from Ashra or with Stephen Parsick from (/ramp]. These guys owns two of six known units of the EKO in Europe. I've spoke to them all and every machine is still in good health.

The EKO Computerhythm was an italian, programmable (the first one!!), custom-made drummachine without trigg, din or any other kind of sync. The first production arrived in 1972, the second in 1974 and the last one in 1978. There was only about 25 machines ever made so it's very rare.

According to Stephen Parsick, Jarre told him that the drums on Equinoxe 5 is the Geiss Rhythmi Computer, which is a programmable Minipops 7. He also confirmed my theory that the EKO is the drums on Equinoxe 4.

btw: I also have samples of the EKO and I don't agree that it's just white and pink noise. Mostly, it sounds like you're hitting a wooden block with a stick.

Great kickdrum though.

The EKO Computerhythm is my holy graal...but not for $1500-$3000